A touch of reality (Part One)

[Alan_Sugar]

I lifted this from another site.

True or what?


Lessons from Spain

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I'd like to post here my experiences with Spain and share them with you. I make no apologies for the length of this post, and nor for the distinct lack of Political Correctness. So, here goes...

What's my involvement with Spain?
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Since Mar 2003, I have been involved in the purchase and sale/disposal/rejection of 4 properties there – 2 in Costa del Sol, and 1 in Costa Blanca, and 1 in Murcia. I don't own anything now. Why Spain? Well, I fell in love with it in 2002 and I've been having this love affair with it ever since, and if I don't go there every 2-3 months, I develop a nervous twitch. I had a dream of owning a property in Spain. But, you know, some dreams are better if they remain un-fulfilled. The difference between going to Spain regularly without owning a property, and actually having a house there is a bit like...<sexist comment ahead> going out with a beautiful girl and enjoying the fruits of nature… and actually marrying said girl, and then realising that thru domestic chores, and harsh realities, that the fruit doesn't quite taste the same any more <end of sexist comment>.

Sometimes, we're busy chasing Dream A, and en-route, we trip over an un-known Dream B and we think “Hey, I didn't see that there. But it looks nice, and I'll have a bit of that, thank you.”

That's what's happened to me. I have embraced the Spanish culture, I've embraced the great food, the hot weather, the language (am doing GCSE this summer) and I've embraced a couple of the local women, and got slapped in return. I will buy and live in Spain when I semi-retire.

I am familiar with the 100 mile stretch from Alicante airport down to Mazarron; and the 50 mile stretch from Malaga airport down to Puerto Banus.

Spain, as a country, is fantastic. But, when it comes to property purchase, there's a few lessons I've learnt.

Real Estate Agents
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If you thought that the agents in the UK are un-trustworthy, then just checkout the ones operating in CDS. There, you will find the biggest collection of wide-boys, barrow-boys and thugs outside of Romford. If any wide-boys or barrow-boys are reading this, and are offended, then I can assure you that it was all totally intended. (I did say I don't 'do' political correctness.) Some of these guys are like Jade Goody – but without her intelligence or social graces.

The best way to deal with an agent in Spain is to ignore 90% of what they say. When they open their mouths, look for 'facts', rather than 'opinions'. When they say “property prices are due to rise 20% this year”, then that's an opinion. So ignore. When they say “this apartment has 2 bedrooms” then that should be a fact, although sometimes that's an opinion too.

Many words can be used to describe estate agents, but I've coined the phrase “professional deceivers” because that is what their job title should really be. This may sound bitter, but it really isn't. It's a dog-eat-dog world we live in, and everyone has to make a living. Some by being honest, and others by being dis-honest. We just have to be aware of that. They're doing what they do best, and we just need to be on our guard.

Remember the motto : Believe nothing, question everything.

Lawyers
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Many lawyers in Spain are very helpful, caring and competent. Honestly, they are. But here's the problem – when they see a British buyer walk thru the door, a little switch in their heads flicks to 'Incompetent Mode'. I'm sure they have a checklist for ensuring that service levels remain low when dealing with British clients.... and this list goes something like this...

“Have I ignored the clients emails/phone calls?” Tick
“Have I refused to clarify the legal points in the contract to client?” Tick.
“Have I acted in the interests of the agent/developer and ignored the clients interests?” Tick. etc

The common rule is that you should never use a lawyer recommended by the agent/developer – since the lawyer will be their mate and look after their needs and not yours. I believe it's worse than that. Even if you pick an independent lawyer, then if you are using an agent/developer, then the lawyer will quickly form a bond these two and build a relationship with them – why? Because he wants to impress the agent/developer as they can supply him another 100 potential customers. And you are just using him for 1 purchase.

What's the way around this? Well there isn't one if you are using an agent/developer. But if you buy direct from the owner, then the lawyer has no reason to suck up to the vendor.

So, why do lawyers give such bad service to us Brits? Well, my guess is because of the following reasons...

- we don't speak the language, so are totally at their mercy

- we know nothing about the legal/administrative process involved

- we physically live so far away

- we don't know who to complain to, if we are not happy with their service.

[Alan_Sugar]

Location
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CDS is much more 'posher', or cleaner, or maturer, or advanced than Costa Blanca, which, in turn, is more than Costa Calida (Murcia). CDS is more lively thoughout the year – esp. in winter when a lot of the facilities are still open. Costa Banca/Murcia is dead in the winter.

Weather-wise, I prefer Costa Blanca (south of Torrevieja), as the dry heat there is incredibly healthy. In fact, some people I speak to say they moved there due to their arthritis problem in the UK, and their condition has got better as a result.

But remember that, out of the peak season most of the 'urbanisations' are like ghost towns. Occupancies levels in CB are less than 10% outside of peak months. The whole place has a deserted, sorry, feel about it.

Off-plan or re-sale?
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When an agent in Spain mentions the phrase “off-plan” to you, look over your shoulder and spit.

Do NOT even think of buying an off-plan. For reasons stated in a previous post, an off-plan sale is based on selling you assumptions, on false promises, on ridiculous price increase projections by agents, on selling you things that don't exist and may never do so.

They're selling you a dream, and not a property.

Again as mentioned on a previous post, buy a physical property that you can see, touch, feel, sit in, break wind in (if you so choose), and walk away from. Buy it in an urbanisation that actually exists – ie. where there are roads, there are electricity and water supplies, and there are telephone connections, there are bars and shops nearby. Buy a re-sale. There are hundreds of 'Se Vende' ('For Sale') signs all over the Costas. Ring the owners direct. This way, you are in control as no one will pressurise you. And remember prices are not rising – so take your time in buying. And you can make an offer way below the asking price.

So, when should one buy
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I believe one should only buy when one is actually ready to LIVE in Spain. Don't buy an investment – because what you buy won't BE an investment. With this in mind, I think one should get to know Spain really, really well, before one decides to live there. And you will know Spain well, when....

- you've lived there for at least 6 months, preferably in different areas
- can say more than “dos cervezas” in the language, and are able to compose sentences like “Doctor, my bowel movements aren't what they used to be”
- you have accepted that, in terms of getting things done, or in terms of corruption, back-handers etc, that Spain is somewhere in between Asian countries and Northern European countries
- you have a social network that extends to more than just meeting up with June and Ted down the 'Union Jack' bar in Torremolenous
- you know your local area so well, that you know where the neighbours dog urinates every morning on his daily walk (Give yourself an extra point if you also know where the dogs owner urinates every evening on his way home from the Union Jack bar.)

Other titbits
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If you find yourself....
- standing in open field with an agent and he's pointing a finger in the distance and saying “Over there will be a new commercial centre, over there will be a horse riding school….” then run as fast as you can;
- having a problem paying the mortgage and bills in the UK, and your partner is saying (whilst in an agents office) “lets buy it love, I'm sure we'll find the money from somewhere”, then run away from both the agent and your partner;
- listening to an agent saying “the bank valuation is for 280,000Euros, and you're getting it for 220,000Euros – so you've already made 60,000 from the day you buy it”, then tell the agent that you know a very useful Spanish word – which is 'cohones'*
- enjoying the entertainment laid out by the agent during an all-inclusive £80 'inspection trip', then enjoy the wine, the food, make polite conversation, but don't sign anything, and thank the poor mug, sorry I mean an 'investor', who's already bought on the previous trip and who's money is being used to subsidise these inspection trips.

Summary
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Basically , don't buy an off-plan; buy when you can live there; live there before you actually buy; be on your guard.

What I have said above probably applies equally well to Romania, Bulgaria, Dubai, Morocco or any other world 'hotspot' where the deadly combination of the following two things exist...

- property is sold off-plan
- property is sold mostly to overseas buyers as opposed to the locals.

These are just my opinions, of course, and I have purposely emphasised the negative, and painted a realistic-if-dim picture, in a bid to alert newbies. I apologise if this sounded like lecturing, or moralising, or I-know-more-than-you, because none of these were intended.

I'm sure there are many success stories, and I'm sure many people have made money. Please take this post in the spirit in which it is intended, and I welcome all comments/insults/abuse etc.

I'll sign off now (I hope to the background noise of tumultuous applause).

[Jane_and_Terry]

3.05am!!!!

Had you just come home, or are you an insomniac??

[Alan_Sugar]

Actually,I'd just returned home from a most enjoyable bender in Almeria, pickling what's left of my liver, in the good company of Senor Fruitas.

He's from Yorkshire tha' knows!

Should you wish to be kept informed with any future details regarding my social activities, just let me know and I would more than happy to supply you with full graphic details of all my nocturnal movements.

Now where did I put that Ex-Lax? ;D ;D

[casafruitas]

Ey up lad!

...and a good time was had by all.....infact look at the time again....really must learn to put a lid on this problem of mine....hic

Senor Fruitas

[jim_c]

well alan what can i say you really are swithed on and every word of it is true as many of us are finding out the hard way,the truth is the spanish have taken the p-ss out of us for many years and now people are doing there talking with there feet!have you tried buying in Turkey they are much more helpful than the spanish at least thats what iv'e found i just hope i will be able to sell my apartment in elzco when the time comes when i look back at what i could have bought 3 yrs ago for the same money i could cry in fact i have never mind worst things happen at sea so they say thanks for the good read.
regards jim c

[missinglink]

I'm not one to defend the middle man, personally my meagre finances aren't enough to share with wolves. However, what implies is terribly biased, as if for the fact of being spanish I, for one, am going to get a better deal out of an agent or lawyer than any of you for being guiris. I've been a guiri long enough away from here and I know what i'm saying, and spanish property agents and lawyers will happily rip off a fellow countryman, ney probs.
However, can make the omelette without enslaving a chicken or something the like, bear in mind that before the affluence of foreigners with wads of dollars to burn, these property market boom didn't even exist. It's a total european invention. People used to live for a pittance here barely five years ago, and it wasn't the likes of me who introduced greed to a virgin population.
Now, what can I say, if you don't trust the law system here, and i can't blame no one for that, you're pretty fxxxd when involved with legalities, :D.
I favour the direct deal, get to know the area as it's been said and then make an offer to something that you're interested in, cross your fingers and if what you're looking for is El Dorado, save time and try next country.
I tell you too that is far more difficult being from here and get used to live there, and we don't moan that much, do we? We don't even have a spanish mafia abroad, and we pulled out from Irak and we risk taking weird ingredients through airports to cook proper paellas for amazed palates when going abroad. And that was humour. Ha.
I truly welcome diversity in this country, if being from here gives me that abstract right, but I rather you've left your market wars back there. It's no ones fault, I know, but you cannot expect a spanish property lawyer to act as a tour operator for free either.